Horses that lack the hingy neck

[5asbs]

Where would you expect a horse to set his head and neck if he lacks a good "hinge" at the poll? His conformational characteristics are as follows:
1. his neck is long enough, but not super elegant
2. he has a decent slant to his shoulder
3. he has decent front end motion
4. he has lots of "try" in him
5. he has a shortish back and can easily get his haunches under himself
6. his neck comes out high in his shoulder, so getting his head "up" is not a problem
7. his throat is a little thick

The concern is more about where his head should be set for his conformation. He has no breathing problems and does not seem uncomfortable in any way when he brings his head up, but his head is not verticle. Currently, the angle of his head profile is near 45 degrees. Thanks for your advice.

How do horses see distance? Do they need to change the angle of their head to see distance vs. near?

[silvia]

Watch him when he is really showing off in the paddock, that ought to tell you where his capacity is in regards to head and neck carriage.

[Rack_On78]

How do horses see distance? Do they need to change the angle of their head to see distance vs. near?

Excerpt from the website below:
One way horses seem to refine their depth perception is to raise, lower and/or tilt their heads.
If a horse is ridden “on the bit” with his forehead vertical to the ground, or overflexed and “behind the bit” with his nose pointed toward his chest, he only sees the dirt beneath his nose. The peripheral vision is still showing what is to the side, but he is working blind in regard to anything smack dab in front of him.

This same article also dispels horses being nearsighted.

http://www.myhorse.com/health/preventative/horse_vision_and_eyesight.aspx#top

I read about Saddlebred neck types and how to show the horse best to his conformation I think it in Show Your Horse by Bob Robinson.

The thumbnail I attached is one of my horses, the picture on the left is him just ho-humming in front of the barn, on the right he is just slightly collected and I’m only using the snaffle bit (it’s a plain snaffle).

My trainer had a mare with amazing motion that could not flex at her pole while in a high headset, he would lower her head to where she could flex at the poll and was able to win with that. He asked me how she looked after winning a class one night and I said 'her head was low' he replied with, 'It’s better to have a collected horse…'

Hope this was helpful I realize this is an old post.

[Mona129]

Sounds like a fantastic sport horse prospect. You are making me DROOL!

I agree, watch in turnout where he is putting it.

[3kidsandahorse]

This brings up a good question:

If a horse gets more animated when he/she raises up, even though the nose comes out a bit, is that better than having a perfect headset?

[Thunderstruck]

Even if they have no hinge at the poll the way you work them in lines and jogging can make a difference if you can get them to flex to develop and stretch those neck muscles so they can have the look of a hinge even if they don't really have one. Lots of flexing with the overcheck off to stretch those neck muscles out.

When I look back at old tapes and pictures of Dylan his neck just goes straight up with no flex at all. It was a constant struggle to hit that balance between head high enough to look good but not too high as to have him stick his nose out. In the last couple of years my trainer has managed to get a slight flex at the poll out of him and now he looks OK pretty much wherever his head is...some places are better than others...but I don't have to worry about it as much as I once did. He's never going to put his head in my lap and look like a chess piece, but he's much better than he was.

[3kidsandahorse]

So it's like a sliding scale--head down enough to bend but not enough to reduce motion?

[wilkinak]

Sounds a bit like my horse. Lots of do, and thorobred neck. After 9 months of work, a jowl sweat that almost never comes off, and quite a bit of time in bitting rig, we are starting to see a bit of curve. She doens't put her head vertical, either. Look at the older pictures - a lot of great horses (Wing Commander, The Lemon Drop Kid,etc) didn't have their heads 90 degrees to the ground. Start your own trend! If you look back, before the 9 mil varations of pleasure classes, not all walk-trots had the best necks either.

[sdlbredfan]

Sounds a bit like my horse. Lots of do, and thorobred neck. After 9 months of work, a jowl sweat that almost never comes off, and quite a bit of time in bitting rig, we are starting to see a bit of curve. She doens't put her head vertical, either. Look at the older pictures - a lot of great horses (Wing Commander, The Lemon Drop Kid,etc) didn't have their heads 90 degrees to the ground. Start your own trend! If you look back, before the 9 mil varations of pleasure classes, not all walk-trots had the best necks either.

Having face out in front of vertical never hindered Wing Commander any! The chesspiece headset that many wish their horses had often comes at the expense of correct neck conformation. That type of headset often is found along with a ewe neck, which has always been a conformational fault, per time honored standards of horsemanship. I think it is a very bad thing that ewe necks have crept into the breed and are 'prized' by those who do not understand it is not a good thing for a horse to have.
Jeanie

[Daisygirl]

Having face out in front of vertical never hindered Wing Commander any! The chesspiece headset that many wish their horses had often comes at the expense of correct neck conformation. That type of headset often is found along with a ewe neck, which has always been a conformational fault, per time honored standards of horsemanship. I think it is a very bad thing that ewe necks have crept into the breed and are 'prized' by those who do not understand it is not a good thing for a horse to have.
Jeanie

I agree wholeheartedly. I will take a shorter necked horse, maybe even tending towards straighter necked, then "turkey necked" as I call them. SO incorrect. I think though that there aren't as many of them as there used to be. BLAH. Just because their head is up does not mean it looks good!

[3kidsandahorse]

Just because their head is up does not mean it looks good!

I know of a horse whose head is up but I think you could serve lunch on the horse's face. :blush: So in that case I agree with you both.

[Sit]

They all have the ability to hinge some. I agree with jogging with the head tipped over (letting the neck come up out of the shoulders and then tipped at the nose).

Some "straight-necked" horses can raise their necks from the shoulders (so to speak). Donna Moore has been quoted as saying WGC Yorktown looked like he had swallowed a board and standing he was straight necked, but somehow Tom Moore got a whole neck full of hinges.

You are limited by confirmation, but Saddlebreds can do some amazing things with themselves.

[5asbs]

Hey,
Thanks to everyone for your replies. It has been awhile since I've checked in with "Trot". You all just made me love my horse even more (as if that was possible:001_smile: ). I know what you mean about looking back at some old photographs. Many of the "old" champions did not have a verticle head carriage.

Thank you again. I'll check back more often.

[LLavery]

Wow... how well and succinctly have you pointed out the difference between apples and tomatoes!!! Always remember my philosophy..in any breed, job, or division...a nice horse is a nice horse is a nice horse!!!!

LFL